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For Your Benefits
For Your Benefits
Educating & Engaging Employees to Combat Rising Healthcare Costs
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Educating & Engaging Employees to Combat Rising Healthcare Costs

When it comes to engaging employees, a strong and strategic package can help your business stand out from the competition. However, between shutdowns, remote work, and resignations, employees are increasingly more concerned about safeguarding their physical and mental wellbeing.

While companies constantly work to reduce costs and increase profits, they also want to offer their employees the best possible health benefits. How can benefits advisors help them make healthcare more affordable and accessible while being mindful of cost?

In order to take full advantage of their benefits, it’s important for employees to understand their plans. Through education, employers can encourage healthy behaviors and preventive care measures so that everybody gets the care they need—without breaking their budgets.

In this episode of For Your Benefits, we talk with Chris Wolpert, Founder of Group Benefit Solutions, about why educating and engaging employees is important to combating rising healthcare costs. He also discusses why he is passionate about employees having access to the highest quality care while reducing out-of-pocket costs.

Learn more strategies that self-insured employers can use to improve their employees’ health while being mindful of their bottom line, in this recent blog post, Improving Employee Health with Value-Based Benefit Design

In This Podcast

Chris Wolpert

Chris Wolpert is the founder of Group Benefit Solutions, who’s mission is to eliminate employee’s out-of-pocket costs while guiding them to the highest quality healthcare available. He is an Amazon best-selling author of NextGeneration Healthcare as well as the comic book Hit Zero: The Quest to Make Healthcare a Controllable Expense, was awarded Rising Star by Employee Benefit News, and named a Face-of-Change by Benefits PRO. Chris has been a guest speaker at national conventions as well as local events, and has been interviewed for stories appearing in US News & World Report, SELF Magazine, Cluch.co, Moneyish.com, Employee Benefits News, and Benefits PRO.

Amy Utterback:

Hello. And welcome back to For Your Benefits, the podcast where we talk with HR professionals, benefit advisors, and other experts about the latest employee benefits, news, trends, and tips. I’m Amy Utterback, VP of business development at SentryHealth, sponsors of For Your Benefits. Our guest today is Chris Wolpert. Chris, welcome. Thank you for joining us.

Chris Wolpert:

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Amy Utterback:

Chris is a consultant, speaker at national conventions, and also the founder of Group Benefit Solutions. Chris is also an Amazon best-selling author and I definitely want to talk to you some more about the comic book that you wrote, which we’ll get to that a little bit later. And you’ve also, I’m told, been awarded the rising star by Employee Benefit News and also named a face-of-change by BenefitPRO. 

Today, we’re going to be taking time to discuss why educating and engaging employees is important in order to combat the rising healthcare costs. With that, Chris, I’d just like to start off by learning a little bit more about you and the work that you do.

Eliminate Employees’ Out-of-Pocket Expenses

Chris Wolpert:

Our mission is to eliminate employees’ out-of-pocket expenses while simultaneously guiding them to the highest quality care that’s available. And the best part is for those companies that we work with, not only are there bottom line savings that are generated for those employees, of course, when we talk about eliminating deductibles, copays, et cetera, we’re also reducing the spend or reducing the expense for the organizations we work with as well, which seems very counterintuitive. And that’s part of why I’m so passionate about it is that it really is counterintuitive to say, “Hey, we’re going to get your people into higher quality care. And yet we’re also going to be saving you and them money in the process.”

Amy Utterback:

I did, I was actually going to call that out and noticed that’s part of your mission statement is the fact of eliminating costs for employees. And I really love that you call that out as opposed to going for saying, “Hey, employers, we’re going to save you the money.” So, let’s talk a little bit more, that is actually also a goal of SentryHealth, so I get how that works, but let’s talk a little bit more and dive deeper about if I’m an employer, how does saving money for my employees save money for me ultimately?

Chris Wolpert:

When you look at what’s happened over years and years, and really, and decades at this point, a lot of times this benefits decision was just delegated to HR. They handled it, they took care of the renewal, making sure everybody had a packet and a card in their wallet and those kinds of things for years and years. And that worked for a long time. But what happened was there’s that old saying about how to boil a frog one degree at a time, you drop it in the water, then you turn up the heat, and slowly it doesn’t realize it’s being cooked, and it is. And that’s kind of what’s happened here, get a 5% to 10% renewal increase each year.

And sometimes it’s hidden by a rise in the deductible, maybe a $500 deductible last year is now a $750 deductible. And then the year after that, then it’s $1,000 and then it’s $1,500. And so, the benefits get skinned down to a certain point that employees now are afraid to use their plan because they’re afraid of the financial cost that’s going to take place.

And then on top of that, you’ve also got a very opaque, confusing, and fragmented healthcare system, so when somebody has some kind of major medical event, they’re not sure what to do about that. They’re not sure where to go. It’s not like when you pull up at a car lot and you can see the prices of each of the cars listed on the windshield, right? It’s not like when you show up at a restaurant, you open up a menu and you have some idea of what you’re ordering and what the cost is going to be before that. Essentially what I’m getting to in a very roundabout, drawn out, rambling way, is that for many years, this decision was made by HR, finance, and perhaps leadership or ownership, for a smaller company, and then a broker or a consultant such as myself. 

So you’ve really got a room of three or four people that are paternalistically deciding what the benefits are going to be, being the central planners, if you will, for the health plan, but really just deciding what’s going to be best for all employees. And the means by which to evaluate that is they’re looking at how noisy is this going to be for us. AKA, how many complaints are we going to get that either we changed things or we didn’t change anything? Right? So, employers were stuck in between this rock and a hard place.

Well, what our value proposition does is it re-centers the conversation around the employee. So now we’re making the employee center of this decision, not necessarily what the budget is going to be for employees or how many complaints they’re going to get at the leadership level, but really ultimately ensuring that people are getting access to higher quality care. I don’t think anybody would argue that we want to make sure that our employees get to the highest quality care.

And just other areas and aspects of our business. We don’t necessarily want to be overpaying for that, right? So if I’m working with a cabinet manufacturer that’s trying to source raw materials and hardware and all those kinds of things, they’re negotiating down to a 10th of a penny on some of these things that they’re buying in bulk. And why shouldn’t they be able to do the same thing for healthcare services? Why shouldn’t they able to be able to do the same thing for scans, images, x-rays, surgeries, and the list goes on and on? But really just centering that discussion around the employees and their wellbeing.

Because that’s frankly, what a lot of people want. They don’t necessarily just want to have a card in their pocket. They want to be healthy. They want to live their lives. They want to be able to work and those types of things, without having any fear of going broke should they have a major medical event or being one of these people that has a chronic condition, diabetes, heart disease, renal failure, whatever the case might be, so on and so forth, but making sure that they can get access to the highest quality care based on evidence-based medicine. And when they do so, when opting in for that care, they get their deductible waved, they get their copays waved. They have no co-insurance or out-of-pocket, or things like that.

Are Rising Healthcare Costs Influencing Today’s Workforce?

Amy Utterback:

I do think that there is an amount of educating of the employee that has to go on there. Right? I read recently there’s an estimate that 100 million adults in the United States have some amount of healthcare debt and about 12% of that is over $10,000. And at the same time though, we’re entering a recession and yet employers keep seeing record numbers of employees voluntarily resigning. I know that is a concept that goes beyond just talking about healthcare benefits, but how do you think that the rising healthcare costs can influence today’s workforce?

Chris Wolpert:

It is something that’s an ancillary problem to the great resignation, right? How do employers…how do they get people to work? And it’s really all different industries, all different areas of the economy. I mean, we’ve witnessed this quite a bit over the last year or so now. And it’s interesting because it’s not all that much different than back in 2018, 2019 when we had record low unemployment and employers were saying, “Everybody has a job right now, so how do we position ourselves to bring on additional talent, to attract and retain new quality employees?”

And it was the same message then, that we have now, it’s a little bit different in the reasons why they’re not able to get people to come to work for them, but essentially, it’s kind of like… one of the first things I ask employers when we sit down and talk to them is, “What’s your philosophy around benefits? What’s your philosophy around compensation?” Right?

There’s one employer that is going through a renewal with us right now. The only thing she cares about is staying out of the compliance hot water with the DOL, the IRS, and those kinds of things. So it’s a little bit different solution that’s going to be tailored for them than it is somebody else who says to me, “You know what? I want people…” And I’ve had clients tell me this before, I’ve had clients say, “Look, I want people to feel like when they come to work for us, they feel like they’ve made it, right? This is their dream job. This is the industry they want to work in. They’re highly professional. They’re highly proficient. They want to be compensated well. But we also want to have the best possible benefits to round out that compensation package.”

And so obviously it’s going to be a little bit different for each of those and everybody that’s in between, but what we tend to find is that when we are able to position this in such a way and say, “Hey, look, when you are putting a want ad out, when you’re trying to attract new employees, get a position filled, what do you do now?”

Right now, traditionally, what you’ll do is list out the job description. Maybe have a few things just talking about the job and your company. And then you’re going to list out the compensation or maybe a range, and then list out the dental, vision, life insurance, health insurance, 401k plan, whatever you’re offering, you just have a list of those things. Right? And that’s kind of table stakes I think for most people that are entering the labor market right now, trying to figure out where to work next.

Well, what I always tell them is, “Hey, look, let’s A/B test that. You do your normal job posting just like you normally would. But right next to that, let’s do a B test where we basically do the same thing, but instead of just listing out medical, dental, vision, 401k, blah, blah, blah, whatever it is, put in there that there’s a free healthcare program or zero deductible healthcare option or something that alludes to the fact that they have no deductible, that they have nothing else above and beyond their premium share, even if there is even that, where they have an idea of how different this is.” And that’s going to catch their eye.

And what we tend to find is that it’s three to four, to as many as five times, these days, at least anyways, as many callbacks or clicks or however you’re tracking that, but you get far more attention when you mention free healthcare, zero deductible health plan, so on and so forth. That’s going to grab people’s attention much more so than just listing out medical, dental, vision, and 401k.

Helping Employers Understand that Employees can have Influences on Healthcare Costs

Chris Wolpert: 

They’re going to be curious, but I think the message that it sends to the labor market is, “Hey, we’re a company that cares about our employees. And we care about you so much that we’re not going to dictate the terms for you for your benefits plan each year. We’re going to give you something of real value, something that you’re not going to have to use those hard-earned dollars when you have to go in to have a surgery or have some kind of diagnostic event or whatever the case is. We have a health plan that is based on evidence-based medicine, but that’s an incentive program that allows you to decide if you want to opt in for that.

“Or if you want to engage with the plan the same way you are today, pull that card out of your pocket when you go into the doctor’s office or when you go into the pharmacy. Great, you can continue to do that and engage with the plan the same way you are today. Just know that you’ll still, just like you do today, have a deductible to meet, copays, co-insurance, and an out-of-pocket maximum.” Whereas when we use that other path, we can eliminate all of those things because of the way we design the plan. And that’s really where the secret sauce is. If there is any secret sauce, is just designing a plan that incentivizes those employees to seek out that higher quality care.

And by the way, that’s something we do for them. This isn’t the old HSA high deductible plan story where essentially they’re just left to do the consumerism piece on themselves. We’ve got a team of nurses, doctors, and AI technology, that’s helping navigate the healthcare system, looking at CMS data, and a number of other different data points to determine the quality of these doctors, facilities, surgeons, whatever the case might be, and then directing patients or guiding patients to go to those higher quality providers and facilities, because when they do, they’re rewarded with having a deductible eliminated, copays, coinsurance. And we know based on this evidence-based medicine that they’re going to higher quality care. And so it really hits the center of the bullseye for everybody in this process.

Educate Employees on their Current Benefits

Amy Utterback:

And what you’re describing makes total sense to me having been around the industry. I do think, obviously we face a challenge in educating employees. In general, employees have been raised to not be consumers of healthcare. We don’t even realize that we can be consumers of healthcare. What recommendations do you, as an advisor, make? What can advisors do to help employers to really educate employees to the fact that they have influence over their healthcare cost?

Chris Wolpert:

Yeah, absolutely. Well, that is the trick. I mean, that’s the tricky part and that’s really where we have to do some heavy lifting as a firm or as advisors and as consultants in general. But it really involves a multi-pronged approach in terms of communicating this to employees, because it is much different than what they’ve had. It is a lot different. Even though they may have hated what they had before, they’ve got something new and they don’t understand it. And so communication is a huge component. And in fact, any great strategy or tactic or anything that you want to try is going to fall flat if it’s not communicated properly to employees.

And so what involves proper communication in this 21st century economy that we’re in? Well, in my humble opinion, you need to meet people where they’re at. And where they’re at these days is they’re on their smartphones. I always joke, this is the remote control of our lives. We do everything on our phones these days, in just navigating to figure out how to get to a new place, a restaurant or something we’ve never been to before, having an Uber or a Lyft come pick us up, planning a vacation, checking email, setting your fantasy football lineup. I mean, there are any number of things that you can do on your phone. And so why not be able to access your benefits information and the resources that are available to you right on your smartphone, right from that remote control by just simply hitting a button?

First and foremost, one of the first things that we do is we do a text message campaign at open enrollment, where we’re texting out information about open enrollment. The fact that it’s opening up, the fact that there’s going to be something that’s new and exciting this year that maybe perhaps you haven’t had in the past. We typically will embed a link tree that’ll have a number of different things within that link that are embedded in that text.

But within that link tree, what we’re doing is we’re storing plan design and summary information. We’ve got quick videos that explain how the medical advocacy team or the nurse concierge team works. We’ll have links where they can click to go into the App Store, where they can download the app that we’ll be using to communicate all this. They can begin to do their open enrollment. They can look at additional PDFs or information that we have.

And the other thing that they can do is they can actually click on a scheduler link to talk to somebody on our team, a licensed benefits counselor who’s an expert in all things benefits, to help them understand what’s available to them. Right? They’ve got all these things at their disposal now, but again, they’ve just been used to having handed a packet and a card that comes in the mail, and that’s the extent of their benefits communication. Maybe there’s a group meeting type of thing, right?

Whereas we can do all of that online so that now people are doing it either self-service, I’d say probably about two thirds to three quarters of folks just do everything self-service, they’re happy with that. They don’t want to have to talk to anybody. They know enough to just get through it. And then you’ve got others who want their spouse involved, or what we see in a lot of cases with the younger workforce as maybe they want their parents involved in the discussion and the conversation and the decision making process. Or they just simply want to talk to somebody. They are maybe not super tech savvy and just some want somebody to walk them through the process of enrolling in these benefits, understanding everything that’s available to them.

And then the other thing that we can do with that is… And again, we’ve got all of this housed within one mobile app that’s stored on their phone, information about the nurse concierge, the plan design, they can store a picture of their ID card, so it doesn’t get lost or whatever, they can search where they can find a lower price prescription at nearby pharmacies and price shop that way. They’ve got telehealth, mental health services, and a number of things that are embedded all in this app. So a lot of times what we’re doing as well throughout the plan year is we’re reminding them about how robust their benefits package is. And what’s included in all that too. Right? So just reminding them when they had an open enrollment, say here in August, well, what’s going to happen in January or February when they forgot about everything that’s happened at open enrollment?

Typically, what we’ll do is throughout the plan year, we’ll do a text message blast, sometimes monthly, usually quarterly is enough, but we’re blasting out this information to remind them, “Hey, make sure to open up this app. You’ve got some great things in here.” But we typically are trying to redirect employees to open the app and call the nurse. That’s the message that we deliver to them constantly, rather than having to bombard HR with every little question about their benefits plan. It’s like, hey, everything you have, everything I have as an HR person is right there on that app.

So, if we can redirect people to have their own self-service and then support that with call center and other kinds of resources of experts to people to walk through employees how to use this properly, that’s where we really find the magic is that employees tend to be very excited about that. Right? They’ve got something that, again, it’s a benefits package and it’s a delivery method for the 21st century.

Traditional Benefit Plans vs a More Modernized Solution

Amy Utterback:

And that’s a delivery method that I think makes a lot of sense for the employee experience. I want to flip back now to talking again a little bit more about the challenge for a lot of advisors is convincing the employer to get away from the more traditional styles of plans. I know I’ve talked to a lot of employers who, just that American dream sort of mindset that just expects that more expensive care equals better care. I see you shaking your head. I am too inside. But what is that conversation like? How do you combat that when you’re talking to an employer?

Chris Wolpert:

I think sometimes what happens with us at least anyways, is because we really lead with that, with eliminating employees’ out-of-pocket, guiding people to higher quality care. A lot of times the pushback I get is, well, it’s like, again, to your point, they’ve been conditioned to think that there’s only one way to do it. They’ve been conditioned to think that they have to go with a big carrier, that they need to move from one big carrier to the next each year to chase down the rate and keep it somewhat manageable, or they need to increase the employer contribution. And part of that is, again, the brokers have been part of the problem here. Right? It’s pretty obvious to point at the insurance carriers and say, “This big behemoth corporation is the cause of all our problems.” And then it’s also easy to point at these large hospital systems and say, “Geez, hospitals are businesses too, and they’re poorly run. And so the insurance companies and the hospitals, they’re putting the screws to the little guy.”

And while I wouldn’t necessarily argue against that, I would say that health brokers over the years have been part of the problem as well. There’s a misaligned incentive that exists with them too. And so employers for a lot of time have been just conditioned to believe, because of brokers, because of advisors and consultants, to think that there’s nothing they can do to control these costs.

And so I know you do want to talk a little bit about the comic book, but that was part of my mission with the comic book—it wasn’t to do any kind of nitty gritty detail education, but was really just simply to say, “Hey, look, you need to shake off this old legacy way of thinking and realize that you can actually control healthcare costs. And it’s not this binary decision of raising deductibles equals lower premiums or raising premiums equals a richer plan.” Again, when you think about the analogy of the car lot, or the restaurant, for example, again, you have an idea of what you’re going to pay.

But when you go into a hospital for a surgery, or before so, and you say call them and say, “Hey, what’s it going to cost?” First of all, they’re not going to be able to tell you, or they’re going to ask you, “Well, that depends on which insurance company you have.” Whereas if you go to a restaurant, you’re not going to have a different bill at the end if you’re paying with cash or check or Visa or MasterCard or whatever, it’s just crazy. And again, that’s part of what the problem is, right, is that it is so opaque and confusing.

So if we can reframe that, at least from the standpoint that, “Hey, look, your brokers that are being compensated on commission, they’re getting bonuses and overrides, and retention bonuses, and things like that. When they keep you with the same plan year after year, their revenue goes up, their commission goes up when your premium has gone up.” And that’s something I like to point out with these insurance carriers too, is it’s like, look, what you call premium, they call revenue. So there’s no incentive for them to help you reduce your premium because that reduces their revenue.

So if you can align all of these interests, and really, because employers are the ones that are footing the bill for, let’s call it 50% of Americans, and yet they have no transparency into this, that’s inherently a problem. And so typically where I like to start, frankly, because there’s been so much conditioning before I show up on the scene, then it sounds like I’m like, I don’t, speaking witchcraft or magic, or just making promises that, “Oh gee, yeah, we’ve heard this before. Yeah, you’re going to lower claims and you’re going to lower our costs.”

Amy Utterback:

The crazy man on the corner. Right? The conspiracy theorist. Yeah.

Chris Wolpert:

Yeah. “We’ve heard this before.” So typically what I tell them is, “Look, in the first year, we may not change a thing. Right? I’m going to show you what the destination is. I’m going to show you case study examples of where we’ve done this with groups that are a similar size, in a similar industry, in a similar geographic region.” But the point is this inverse relationship between cost and quality is not unique to me here in the greater Seattle area. It’s this way across our entire country.

And so, when we look at it, it’s like, look, the first thing we want to do is just ensure that there’s a destination we can take you to. Now, it may take us 3, 5, or 7 years to get there, but we’ll start at square one where we don’t want to have a very noisy experience for your employees, because then the perception is going to be, “All right. Well, this doesn’t work. It’s too much. It’s too different. It’s too noisy, blah, blah, blah.”

Chris Wolpert:

So let’s not change anything. Let’s keep you with the same carrier, same plan, same contract, any of those kinds of things. We can bolt on this one little simple solution with this mobile app where, when using this, we can still, even though you’re still with the same carrier, the same program that you’re with now, we can still begin to eliminate deductibles, copays, co-insurance, any of those types of things. There are strategies, there are solutions that are in place where we can make the minimal amount of change, and yet begin to get people in that frame of mind where they’re opening up their mobile app to use their benefits resources, get their deductibles and copays eliminated, so on and so forth. 

Amy Utterback:

So a layered approach to entering?

Chris Wolpert:

It’s more of the crawl versus the walk versus the run. Everybody’s a little bit different. I get some people that tell me, “No, I don’t care how noisy it is. We need to do this. We need to do this to keep our doors open, to keep our margins within something reasonable.” And so it just depends on where they’re at. But more often than not, they take that walk approach in that first year, which again is totally fine.

I’d rather have them in the door, continue to educate them along the way and then start to show them what’s possible as they start to see additional case studies and start to interact with some of our clients and start to understand how we put this together and how we communicate this so that there’s not this mass confusion and anger, and then ultimately an exodus when employees say, “All right, well, I’m going somewhere else that isn’t going to change the benefit plan.” Or they are going to change the benefit plan or whatever somebody’s upset about that day. Right?

Helping the Industry Understand Insurance and Employee Benefits With a Comic Book

Amy Utterback:

Sure. There’s always going to be something, right? And you did mention the comic book that you wrote. And I just thought it was such a creative and fun and interesting spin on being able to help the industry understand insurance and employee benefits. So I do want to just give it a shout out, listeners, it’s called Hit Zero: The Quest for Making Healthcare a Controllable Expense. Just curious, I know you talked about it already a little bit, but what made you think of putting something out into the marketplace?

Chris Wolpert:

That was the idea behind it, this was several years ago now, I had started to write a book about the post ACA, the way to build a post ACA health plan. I started writing it, I did an outline and I was like, “Oh my gosh, I am so bored with this. I don’t even want to write this book. Nobody’s going to want to read it.”

So I regrouped, and there was a podcast I heard where this guy was talking about how to build a hero’s journey story and apply that in a business sense to teach a lesson. Because people generally, they engage with stories and everybody can follow this hero’s journey arc through… really any story has this hero’s journey arc. So I thought, “Gosh, that would be clever to just have a little short little story that I could tell, and maybe that’s a way to go about doing it. It would be a little bit different.”

And then I have this idea about making that into a comic book. Again, just as a way to, rather than have somebody read a 200-page book, why not create a comic book that they can flip through in half an hour and that they can, again, use it as a talking point and be something that’s a pattern interrupt? Because I know there are a lot of other salespeople and consultants that write books in order to gain traction in their marketing efforts.

Amy Utterback:

We’ve seen a lot. Yeah. We see it a lot.

Chris Wolpert:

I mean, ultimately that’s what I wanted to do, but I wanted to have it be a fun story. I wanted to have it be something that was engaging and that would show up on their desk, whether it was an owner, an HR director, a CEO, a CFO, and just think, “Oh wow, this is a different approach.”

And that’s happened too, by the way. It’s amazing how many times where I’ve called somebody and, “Oh yeah, I was the guy that sent you that comic book.” “Oh my gosh. Yeah, that was so clever.” And most of the time they haven’t read it, but it was not quite as time consuming to produce it. I had somebody help me with the artwork itself.

I just went on Fiverr and found a guy that was able to put that together for me and do all the artwork for me. And then ultimately then got it out in front of folks. And yeah, it’s something I think is memorable. It teaches some very high-level lessons just about healthcare being a controllable cost. You do have to smash these limiting beliefs that you had for years and years, but that it is possible for you, no matter what size or funding type or geographic region of the country that you’re in.

Amy Utterback:

I definitely thought it was a really clever thing and a landscape where like you said, there are so many books out there about the same topic that are great resources, but something that really stands out. I thought that was a great approach. And I know that we’ve already taken a lot of your time, but I just want to finish up with a couple more questions if that’s okay with you, Chris?

Chris Wolpert:

Sure.

How Can Benefit Advisors Modernize their Clients’ Health Plans to Engage Employees?

Amy Utterback:

As an advisor that clearly has a lot of experience and knowledge in the industry, what single piece of advice would you give to another benefits advisor when it comes to modernizing their clients’ health plans?

Chris Wolpert:

I would go back to what I just said a few moments ago, meet them where they’re at. There were a few clients early on that I really pushed them in this direction. Right? And in hindsight, obviously, they were not ready for that. The other thing was we didn’t really have a robust communication campaign and strategy around that. That was born out of some of those early failures, was A, just meeting people where they’re at. Look, if they’re not ready to do this today, square one, they’re not as excited about it as I am, that’s fine. I totally get it, right? But I’m going to continue to show them that destination. And I’m going to continue to show them how they can get to that destination.

And that’s where, a lot of times what I find, particularly with people that are in finance, they want to see how is this going to work exactly? This all sounds great. We meet with a number of sales consultants and advisors and things, but how do we actually ultimately do this? And if they’re starting to get to those “how” questions, that’s when you realize, okay, this is somebody who wants to do it. Not somebody who’s just going along with what you’re saying, but really meeting them where they’re at. Because it could be that you do need to walk them into this. It could be that they’re not quite ready for it themselves, let alone ready to introduce their employees to something that is different than what they’ve had before. Even though it’s a lot better, you and I know that Amy, but it’s one of these things that… change is hard for human beings in general. And so if you can just meet them where they’re at, that is the place to start. That’s my best advice for an advisor trying to build out these kinds of plans.

Amy Utterback:

I like the crawl, walk, run scenario, letting people come to it on their own. And it’s not as abrasive for the group. Once they get a new plan structure and a new design and they don’t have a BUCA name on their card anymore, it’ll all be okay. It will. Chris, thanks again for your time. How can people get a hold of you?

Chris Wolpert:

As a sales guy, as a consultant, I don’t tend to hide myself, so I’d say you could probably find me online and on LinkedIn is probably where I’m most active on, social media at least anyways.

Amy Utterback:

Absolutely.

Chris Wolpert:

Would love to help support folks in however I can do that as well.

Amy Utterback:

Thank you so much, Chris. And that wraps up this episode of For Your Benefits. We hope that you enjoyed today’s conversation. If you like what you heard today and want to hear more, don’t forget to subscribe to our podcast. We’ll continue to keep you updated on what’s happening in the world of employee benefits. Thanks for joining us and have a fantastic day.

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